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美国网友问:中国人真的认为西方人很天真很幼稚吗?

2024-02-06文化

西方国家总爱为中国指出「正确的道路」并「教导」他从西方世界的角度来看事情,无论是国家事务还是中国内政,他们总爱将自己抬举成「教师爷」。在美版知乎Quora上,美国网友问:中国人认为西方人很天真很幼稚吗?这引起各国网友的热议。

问题

德国网友亚历山大·费曼的回答

I am not Chinese. But my impression is:

我不是中国人。但我的印象是:

Considering that China is a country with a rich history and culture of 5000 years, it would be impolite for Chinese people to come here and tell them about the values of Western style freedom and democracy.

考虑到中国是一个有着5000年历史的丰富历史文化的国家,当西方人来到这里先上来就向他们讲述西方式自由民主的价值观时,中国人会感到很失礼。

My impression is that they see some capital and media members, people like Trump, and others who believe that Western culture is "better" than Eastern culture, which is indeed naive. The reason is that if they understand the advantages of Chinese culture, they will not easily try to change it, which brings a voice imbalance to some Westerners and makes dialogue difficult. Because you must engage in meaningful conversations with someone with a certain degree of openness.

我的印象是,他们看到一些资本和媒体成员,像特朗普这样的人,以及其他认为西方文化「优于」东方文化的人,确实很天真。原因是,如果他们了解中国文化的优点,他们就不会那么轻易地试图改变中国文化,这给一些西方人带来了一种声音失调,使对话变得困难。因为你必须以某种程度的开放态度与某人进行有意义的对话。

Some Westerners also naively believe that they can attack another country and impose Western style democracy on the people, and they will be grateful for it. This is a disaster in Iraq and Haiti. The neoconservatives are naive, lacking an understanding of the subtle differences and complexities of other cultures and people, and exhibiting a certain degree of moral hijacking style arrogance and paternalistic style.

一些西方人也天真地认为,他们可以攻击另一个国家,把西方式的民主强加给人民,他们会感激的,这在伊拉克、在海地都是一场灾难。新保守派很天真,他们缺乏对其他文化和人的细微差别和复杂性的理解,还表现出一定程度上道德绑架式的自以为是和家长式作风。

中国网友王辉的回答

I am a Chinese and live in Chinese Mainland two-thirds of the time. When I was a child, I never went abroad. I really believe that the West is superior to the East in all aspects, and the Chinese are still very naive.

我是一名中国人,三分之二的时间生活在中国大陆,当我还是个孩子的时候,我没有去过外国,我确实相信西方在各个层面上都比东方优越,中国人还很幼稚。

Then when I traveled to India and Russia, I found that, well, it's not just Chinese people who are naive. Then I went to North America and realized, wow, Americans are also so naive. Finally, I visited Australia and Northern Europe, and I was shocked. Is Bai Zuo really hopeless?!

然后当我去印度和俄罗斯旅行时,我发现,好吧,不仅仅是中国人天真。然后我去了北美,我意识到,哇,美国人也这么天真。最后我访问了澳大利亚和北欧,我很震惊,白左天真的没救了?!

So, yes, sometimes, to some extent, we do think Westerners are naive. Let me share a story that I named "How China Audits a European Company":

所以,是的,有时,在某种程度上,我们确实认为西方人很天真,让我分享一个故事,我把这个故事命名为「中国是如何审计一家欧洲公司的」:

My company acquired a Danish company in 2014, which produces high fidelity equipment. We believe that Danes are very disciplined and can manage their business well, so we didn't even send any management personnel there. But the numbers tell us that we were wrong.

我的公司在2014年收购了一家丹麦公司,他们生产高保真设备,我们相信丹麦人非常自律,能够很好地管理他们的业务,所以我们甚至没有派任何管理人员去那里。但数字告诉我们,我们错了。

As of 2018, the company's cash flow was 82 million dinars and profit was 150 million dinars. Subsequently, their CEO came to China and demanded an additional investment of 150 million RMB, otherwise they would inevitably go bankrupt in 2019 and 600 Danes would lose their jobs. My Chinese boss is very angry and has decided to send an audit team to conduct a comprehensive investigation into the huge losses, and then decide whether to invest more funds, and I am the head of the team.

截至2018年,该公司的现金流为8200万第纳尔,利润为1.5亿第纳尔。随后,他们的首席执行官来到中国,要求再投资1.5亿元人民币,否则他们将不可避免地在2019年破产,600名丹麦人将失业。我的中国老板非常愤怒,决定派一个审计小组对巨大的损失进行全面调查,然后决定是否投入更多的资金,而我是小组的负责人。

Then the story began. When I applied for a Danish business visa, the purpose of my visit was to write "internal audit", and then the visa officer called me in confusion, and the following conversation occurred: "Why do you open a company in such a small town as Skanderberg?"

然后故事开始了。当我申请丹麦商业签证时,我的访问目的是写「内部审计」,然后签证官困惑地打电话给我,发生了如下对话:「你为什么在斯坎德堡这么小的小镇开一家公司?」

"We didn't open it, we just bought that company."

「我们没有开,我们只是买下了那家公司。」

"So is this a Danish company?"

「所以这是一家丹麦公司吗?」

"Originally, but now we are investors."

「本来是的,但现在我们是投资者。」

"Okay, why audit?"

「好吧,为什么要审计?」

"Because we are very concerned about our funds and investments."

「因为我们很担心我们的资金和投资。」

"Why don't you invite a local audit company to do it?"

「你为什么不邀请当地的审计公司来做呢?」

"It's not necessary, we need first-hand information."

「没有必要,我们需要第一手信息。」

"Okay, I cannot determine the nature of your visit. I will forward your application to the Danish Immigration Office for evaluation, and you will receive feedback within 60 working days. During this period, your passport will be kept at the Danish Embassy!"

「好吧,我不能判断你访问的性质,我会把你的申请转交给丹麦移民局做出判断,你会在60个工作日内得到反馈,在此期间,你的护照将被保存在丹麦大使馆!」

60 working days??? Okay, maybe it's too far from Beijing to Copenhagen to send the documents. Waiting day after day, it was in early March, and on the last day of April, I finally received a response from the immigration office. I was refused a visa because they believed I posed a threat to Danish public policy and domestic security.

60个工作日???好吧,也许从北京到哥本哈根太远了,无法发送文件。日复一日地等待,那是在三月初,在4月的最后一天,我终于得到了移民局的回应,我被拒绝签发签证,原因是「他们认为我对丹麦公共政策和国内安全构成威胁」。

I contacted my Danish colleagues and they told me that they have never received any verification requests from any Danish department, no phone calls, no emails, and no letters. So I have enough reason to believe that they are just holding onto my application and no one is asking about my travel situation, they just rejected it with an extremely absurd reason. Thank you to the Danish people for giving me an opportunity to threaten the internal security of a country!

我联系了我的丹麦同事,他们告诉我,他们从未收到任何丹麦部门的任何验证请求,没有电话,没有电子邮件,也没有信件。所以我有足够的理由相信他们只是拿着我的申请,没有人问我的旅行情况,只是以一个极其荒谬的理由拒绝了。感谢丹麦人民给我一个威胁一个国家内部安全的机会!

Obviously, Danish officials are not fully aware of the situation, or they simply do not care about the work of these 600 Danes. This story showcases the ignorant, arrogant, and inefficient European people, as well as the shadows of many other Westerners.

显然,丹麦官员并不完全了解情况,或者,他们根本不关心这600名丹麦人的工作。这个故事展示了无知、傲慢、效率极低的欧洲人民,也是许多其他西方人的影子。

So a long time ago, I no longer believed in Western systems as I used to.

所以很久以前我就不再像以前那样相信西方的制度了。

By the way, another similar story is happening in China. In just one day, I received a product purchased online from Guangzhou to Beijing (about 2000 kilometers). The same thing took two weeks from Chicago to New York, but it was destroyed. I had a month of communication with the seller, but there was no result.

顺便说一句,另一个类似的故事正在发生,在中国,我只花了一天的时间就收到了从广州到北京(约2000公里)的网上购买的产品,同样的东西,从芝加哥到纽约花了两周的时间,但它被破坏了,又与卖家进行了一个月的沟通,但没有任何结果。

海外网友文森特的回答

Usually not.

通常不会。

Compared to Chinese people, Westerners are generally considered more straightforward, polite, affluent, may have received higher education, and sensitive to personal privacy, which is the most basic impression that Chinese people have of Westerners.

与中国人相比,西方人通常被认为更直率、礼貌、富裕,可能受过高等教育,对个人隐私敏感,这是中国人对西方人最基本的印象。

But in some cases, it's different. When some Westerners try to tell Chinese people the true situation of China based on their limited knowledge, they may be a bit naive for some Chinese people.

但在某些情况下就不一样了。当一些西方人试图根据他们有限的知识告诉中国人所谓中国的真实情况时,对一些中国人来说他们可能有点天真。

Due to the fact that China's doors to Western countries are not completely open, apart from information obtained from domestic media, there are naturally not many Westerners who understand the true situation in China. Therefore, it inevitably carries biases.

由于中国对西方国家的大门并不是完全开放的,除了从国内媒体获得的信息之外,自然没有多少西方人了解中国的真实情况。因此,它不可避免地带有偏见。

We know what we have and what this country is doing. We have not been brainwashed, nor have we lacked the ability to think critically.

我们知道我们拥有什么,也知道这个国家在做什么。我们没有被洗脑,也没有缺乏批判性思考的能力。

And history, if you know nothing about Chinese history and culture, then you know nothing about China. From over two thousand years of feudal history, Chinese people believe that unity, bureaucracy, and the doctrine of the mean have merits; Since 1840, the Chinese people have believed that they are not bullied by foreign countries and can only have autonomy. China has tried the Western definition of freedom, democracy, and universal values, which is not very useful. Therefore, the West used to teach Chinese people a lesson with guns and now criticizes them in public opinion, and in theory, it is simply untenable. Therefore, we may feel a bit naive or even childish.

还有历史,如果你对中国的历史和文化一无所知,那么你对中国一无所知。从超过两千年的封建历史中,中国人认为大一统、官僚制和中庸之道具有可取之处;1840年至今,中国人民认为不被外国欺负,唯有掌握自主权,中国试过了,西方定义的自由民主,普世价值那一套用处不大,所以,你们西方以前用枪炮教训中国人,现在又在舆论上抨击中国人,而且理论上根本站不住脚,所以我们会觉得有点天真甚至是幼稚。

Before judging the present, let's first understand the past. My advice to those who are confused is to read more books to understand how China is now.

在判断现在之前先了解过去,我给那些困惑的人的建议是,多看书了解中国怎么会是现在的样子。

Some other answers talk about Trump, the President of the United States. I think Trump's election was not because Americans were too naive, but because they were exhausted by professional politicians and decided to give him another chance, hoping for a good/different outcome.

其他一些答案谈到了特朗普,美国总统。我认为特朗普当选并不是因为美国人太天真,而是因为他们被职业政客弄得疲惫不堪,决定给另一个机会,希望有好的/不同的结果。

Strange viewpoint: I think innocence is more suitable for children and a bit cute. When you grow up, you can't be naive, but you need to maintain a sense of dullness.

奇怪的观点:我认为天真更适合孩子,而且有点可爱。当你长大的时候,你不能天真,但要保持钝感。

网友Joe Xu的回答

I'm Chinese. My answer is affirmative.

我是中国人。我的回答是肯定的。

Many Westerners' decisions stem from their ignorance of history. Everyone's behavior is based on their experience. Similarly, history is a kind of experience, and every country's behavior is based on its history. Due to the lack of history among Westerners, some behaviors are unreasonable for Chinese people. Perhaps we can consider Westerners to be naive because they lack historical experience.

许多西方人的决定源于对历史的无知。每个人的行为都是基于他的经验。与之相似的是,历史是某种经验,每个国家的行为都是基于他的历史。由于西方人缺乏历史,一些行为对中国人来说是不合理的。也许我们可以认为西方人是天真的,因为他们缺乏历史经验。

I gave an example to support my conclusion.

我举了一个例子来支持我的结论。

When the Cold War ended, a question arose on the desk of the President of the United States: how will we deal with Russia in the coming days? The Soviet Union disintegrated, and Russia was also forced to surrender, submitting a petition to the Western world.

当冷战结束时,美国总统的办公桌上出现了一个问题,在接下来的几天里如何与俄罗斯打交道?苏联解体了,俄罗斯也被迫投降,向西方世界递交了投名状。

For Chinese people, making this decision is not difficult. The United States should accept surrender. There are many conquest experiences in our history, and the United States should take a break and wait for the next opponent to appear.

对于中国人来说,做出这个决定并不困难。美国应该接受投降。我们的历史上有很多征服的经验,美国应该休息一下,然后等待下一个对手出现。

Fortunately, the United States did not accept Russia, so Russia has no choice but to make friends with China. Otherwise, the current situation will be even more severe for China.

幸运的是,美国没有接受俄罗斯,那么俄罗斯别无选择,只能和中国交朋友。否则,目前的形势对中国来说更加严峻。

Many Westerners have high intelligence and intelligence, but this decision is based on experience and has nothing to do with intelligence.

许多西方人智商很高,非常聪明,但这种决定是基于经验,与智商无关。

Another example is Trump's trade war policy.

另一个例子是特朗普的贸易战政策。

Why does the United States almost declare war on the world? This is completely unreasonable for the Chinese people. Don't tell me Trump is foolish, I don't think so. Trump's decisions are based on his experience, and he has made every business decision well in his life.

为什么美国几乎与全世界宣战,这对中国人来说是完全不合理的。不要告诉我特朗普很愚蠢,我不这么认为,特朗普的决定是基于他的经验,他一生中的每一次商业决策都做得很好。

I don't think Westerners are not smart, but due to a lack of historical experience, they can sometimes be naive.

我不认为西方人不聪明,但由于缺乏历史经验,他们有时很天真。

网友Qi wu zan的回答

They saw and were shocked by their ignorance, as the West believed that stealing and lying extensively from the world had a future.

他们看到并震惊于他们的无知,西方认为从世界上偷窃和大量撒谎是有前途的。

When Chinese people visit the United States, they cannot believe that their infrastructure is so abandoned and dilapidated, but what is even more incredible is that Americans still believe that the United States is extraordinary, it is the leader of the free world, and when the American Dream is like a nightmare for Chinese people, they can have the American Dream.

当中国人访问美国时,他们无法相信他们的基础设施是如此的荒废和破败,但更令人难以置信的是,美国人仍然认为美国是非凡的,它是自由世界的领导者,当美国梦对中国人来说像噩梦时,人们可以拥有美国梦。

They turned on the TV, read the news, and realized that the West only lies about China and the rest of the world, believing that China and the rest of the world still live on trees and eat like barbarians.

他们打开电视,阅读新闻,意识到西方只读关于中国和世界其他地区的谎言,认为中国和世界其它地区仍然像野蛮人一样生活在树上,吃东西。

0.0001% of Western countries know that the overall growth scale of the G7 in the past decade has been smaller than that of China! Or in 2021 and 2022, the life expectancy of Chinese people exceeded that of the United States! Or simply put, China's middle class is twice the total population of the United States!

0.0001%的西方国家知道,七国集团在过去十年中的整个增长规模比中国小!或者2021年和2022年中国人的预期寿命超过了美国!或者简单地说,中国的中产阶级是美国总人口的两倍!

In the United States, almost no one knows that Chinese people have access to universal healthcare throughout China, regardless of wealth. No one knows that university education is completely free for anyone eligible to attend university. No one knows that the day when the United States dies from firearms is more than 10 years in China!

在美国,几乎没有人知道中国人在整个中国都得到了普遍的医疗保健,无论贫富。没有人知道大学教育对任何有资格上大学的人来说都是完全免费的。绝对没有人知道,美国死于枪支的一天比中国的10年还要多!

中国网友陌尘的回答

Yes, many Chinese people believe that Westerners are naive and foolish, manipulated by Western media to oppose China. The purpose of Western media is to shift domestic class conflicts and social issues.

是的,许多中国人认为西方人天真、愚蠢,被西方媒体操纵反对中国。西方媒体的目的是转移其国内的阶级冲突和社会问题。

Chinese people believe that the actual operation of Western media is a double standard, with false news that slanders China and does not respect human rights rampant. However, the actual number of people lifted out of poverty in China exceeds 400 million, ranking among the top in the world. Chinese people believe that it is foolish for the American people to not wear masks and not respect science; They believe that the so-called COVID-19 gathering is ignorant and absurd, and freedom without borders will only lead to destruction, despair and death.

中国人认为,西方媒体的实际操作是双重标准,污蔑中国和不尊重人权的虚假新闻泛滥,但中国实际脱贫人数超过4亿,居世界前列。中国人认为,美国人民不戴口罩和不尊重科学是愚蠢的;他们认为,所谓的新冠肺炎聚会是无知和荒谬的,没有边界的自由只会带来毁灭、绝望和死亡。

China respects reasonable reporting, but opposes false information and double standards.

中国尊重合理的报道,但反对虚假信息和双重标准。